Qt Certification Exam simulation - would it be 1. legal? 2. useful?



  • Would it be legal to release a software that simulates Qt Certification Exam:

    • app developed from scratch, nothing similar to PearsonVUE app
    • questions created from scratch, but the topics are from Qt Essentials Curriculum Block

    Will it be useful to anyone?
    Anyone interested in such app for mobile platforms? (learn/test on the go)



  • I think it will be legal (simply don't see any legal problems here if all is made from scratch).
    And it will be useful. I remember some people asked about exam simulation.



  • It will be a very useful for me and for my team members.

    Maybe, I can take some part in development/testing.

    Good Luck for your project :)



  • Also about legal thing. I think you can pass set of your questions to Vladimir or someone who can say that this set will be ok.



  • I hope some of trolls will observe this topic and maybe even will be able to give official answers :)



  • I think, if you create the questions from scratch, it should be ok. And I would also be interested in :-) als perhaps in developement.



  • Gerolf, not sure about questions. There is some chance that some of this questions will be similar to questions from official set of essentials exam. In this case I think they should be removed/changed.



  • In my opinion main purpose of the certification exam is to make sure that exam takers know the material in order to pass the exam; putting an exam simulator with exam questions/answers out there I think people will try to memorize the questions and pass the exam without having the exam-passing skills, the exam would become meaningless. If we already have the exam answers and pass the exam without knowing the material that good, why bother getting certified



  • Milot, you are right, that's why I'm talking about full difference between official set of questions and questions in simulation.



  • And why create a simulator then? I think it might be the case where people just want to see how the exam would look like... I really don't get why having simulator would be good for exam takers, if you can enlighten me on this?



  • Milot, I can't understand also. As for me curriculum is enough for passing the exam. But some people want simulation. It will be like some training (questions are from topics of curriculum as official set of questions). Not sure it is useful, but it is something that is requested by people.



  • I see... I think it would be better if everyone look at the curriculum block and read material that they already have on Qt Assistant, I haven't seen any other programming framework that has documentation as Qt have, whatever information you need on Qt it's already there, one just have to look for it :)



  • There is an example question on "Qt website":http://qt.nokia.com/developer/learning/certification/exam/format-flow.

    I passed the basic certification and I did the C++ advanced test. I can clearly state, that there is no need to simulate the exam. The questions and their format are easy to understand. The answers are multiple choice.

    If you fail to understand the exam format I really doubt that you are a programmer skilled enough to deserve the certification. Sorry if that sounds a bit rude, but the certification should not be downgraded too much. We all remember the times when it was almost enough to know where the start button in windows is to become some kind of MCxy-something...

    Regarding the legal side:
    Once you take the exam(s) you sign a non disclosure agreement. If you make a training app that at least some minimal sense to its users, I suspect you will break that agreement, because you make public the format of the exam. If you did not take the exam, how will that training give the users any benefit?



  • @Volker,

    I totally agree with you on this!



  • Volker, format of the exam is not under NDA, you can read about format at qt.nokia.com. Questions are under NDA.

    And I'm agreed with you about "the certification should not be downgraded too much". I simply don't think that simulation with completely different set of questions will lead to it.



  • I can't imagine how the questions would not be influenced by the questions of the real exams.

    But all that is speculation, let's wait for the Trolls to comment on that topic. I'm sure they will do, but let them have their well deserved weekend :-)

    For the advanced C++ exam: Read (and understand!) the C++ FAQs on parashift.com and I bet you will pass the test!



  • Volker, I think that classic Stroustrup book will be enough for C++ test :)



  • That's too much pages and way too boring to read. The C++ FAQs is really fun to read (this is often underestimated!)



  • Write the simulation test in QtQuick with fancy animations for extra brownie points. Then we can test our knowledge while we're on the train. Continually update the database with random exam questions.



  • Probably, simulator itself is not very interesting, but the questions database is good. Even if questions are not closely related to exam questions.

    Reading information and answering the questions are diferent task, and you need to practice in both :)



  • [quote author="Gerolf Reinwardt" date="1291414524"]I think, if you create the questions from scratch, it should be ok. And I would also be interested in :-) als perhaps in developement.[/quote]

    Thank you! But if such app and questions will be created, it will be done by my company's developers. We have a need for such exam application for testing candidates/newcomers.



  • [quote author="Denis Kormalev" date="1291414644"]Gerolf, not sure about questions. There is some chance that some of this questions will be similar to questions from official set of essentials exam. In this case I think they should be removed/changed.[/quote]

    I passed the exam 4 monthes ago and don't remember even a one single question.

    Chances that there would be exactly the same questions as in Qt Essentials exam are negligibly small :)



  • [quote author="Milot Shala" date="1291414668"]In my opinion main purpose of the certification exam is to make sure that exam takers know the material in order to pass the exam; putting an exam simulator with exam questions/answers out there I think people will try to memorize the questions and pass the exam without having the exam-passing skills, the exam would become meaningless. If we already have the exam answers and pass the exam without knowing the material that good, why bother getting certified[/quote]

    Since questions are supposed to be different (not completely different, since Curriculum is the same, but significantly different), such 3rd party exam simulation will be useful for detecting topics that should be studied better.



  • [quote author="Volker" date="1291416201"]There is an example question on "Qt website":http://qt.nokia.com/developer/learning/certification/exam/format-flow.

    I passed the basic certification and I did the C++ advanced test. I can clearly state, that there is no need to simulate the exam. The questions and their format are easy to understand. The answers are multiple choice.

    If you fail to understand the exam format I really doubt that you are a programmer skilled enough to deserve the certification. Sorry if that sounds a bit rude, but the certification should not be downgraded too much. We all remember the times when it was almost enough to know where the start button in windows is to become some kind of MCxy-something...

    I totally agree that the exam form is plain simple. Any developer can go through it.
    [/quote]

    The intended audience of the exam simulation are people who would like:

    1. to be more sure that their knowledge is good enough for trying the real exam
    2. to find out what topics have to be studied better
    3. to decide whether they are ready to spent thier time and money

    [quote author="Volker" date="1291416201"]Regarding the legal side:
    Once you take the exam(s) you sign a non disclosure agreement. If you make a training app that at least some minimal sense to its users, I suspect you will break that agreement, because you make public the format of the exam. If you did not take the exam, how will that training give the users any benefit?[/quote]

    Format of the exam, as Denis has already pointed out, is publicly available. The question will be different. Me personally couldn't compose the same questions even on purpose, I don't remember a signle one :)



  • [quote author="tamhanna" date="1291464685"]
    [quote author="infoctopus" date="1291464455"]
    [quote author="Gerolf Reinwardt" date="1291414524"]I think, if you create the questions from scratch, it should be ok. And I would also be interested in :-) als perhaps in developement.[/quote]

    Thank you! But if such app and questions will be created, it will be done by my company's developers. We have a need for such exam application for testing candidates/newcomers.[/quote]

    This could probably be sold...[/quote]

    Yes, probably.

    I think that it would be better to make such application free for personal use.
    And maybe sell it to corporate users with some additional functionality, e.g. history, statistics.



  • [quote author="tamhanna" date="1291465577"]To be honest: multiple choice questions often are harder than normal ones, especially if they were written by a non-expert.[/quote]

    Of course such questions are harder due thier nature.

    Quality of questions is a key success factor. Prior to getting into the databae, questions created by one Qt expert/senior developer must be reviewed by at least another one.



  • [quote author="tamhanna" date="1291466054"]
    I meant, if a moron does the question, one can be both true and false.
    Had this at an university once. Was fun...
    [/quote]

    ;)

    Cross-reviewing should eliminate such questions



  • That's why there is this beta test, to sort such things out.



  • I think beta tests also exist for adjusting level of points for deciding whether exam is passed or failed.





  • Gerolf, beta is closed already (Dec,3 was the last day AFAIR).



  • ups, sorry...
    That I haven't seen.



  • [quote author="Denis Kormalev" date="1291572125"]Gerolf, beta is closed already (Dec,3 was the last day AFAIR). [/quote]

    good news. Waiting for the release! :)



  • infoctopus, I'm more waiting for results of beta :)



  • i guess there's a chance that these two event will be fired at the same time )



  • Didn'tr they say, we get the results of the beta this year? so it can't be far away....



  • Gerolf, yes there were such announcements, but as I understood time estimation was not finished, so it can be moved to Jan for example. Vladimir can clear it.



  • Any official comments on the subject? :)



  • When I took the test they said no later than end of the year... I just hope they meant 2010... :)



  • My question is: why create a new application at all? Applications like this exist already. There are several flashcard like applications that would be useful or could easily be adapted. The hard work is putting together a question database, I think.

    If you would want this thing to be useful for studying, it should also give you some idea of the topical areas where you did well, and the ones you need more study in.


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